Monday, January 30, 2006

Supposition Station

This weekend, while in the comfort of my cozy apartment, nestled on the couch with a cup of tea and my laptop, I broke into the second half of season 3. I watched episodes 3.13-3.19, tapping out as much intel as I could in relation to Rambaldi, Sloane, the Chosen One and the Passenger. Then something very wild occurred to me. Now, stay with me on this…it’s a bit out there…

Let us assume that Sydney is NOT the Chosen One. Let us assume the Irina is the Chosen One. Conrad the Monk told Sydney in the desert that her sister was the Passenger. So, if Irina is in fact the Chosen One, that would mean that either Elena or Katya is the Passenger. I am leaning towards Elena. If you think about it in simple terms, take a gander at the Rambaldi symbol. Two sisters fighting over?? A big ball? Perhaps a big red ball, much like Irina and Elena did in the finale of season 4.

Now, it is said in the prophecy that the Chosen One, “with unseen marks” would bring forth Rambaldi’s work in the form of a child. Sydney was able to stop the Covenant’s efforts in producing a child from her eggs and Rambaldi’s DNA, but if Irina is the Chosen One, then Sydney or Nadia would be that child. It seems more likely that Nadia would be this conduit, as she was able to, with the help of the green Rambaldi liquid, channel Rambaldi and scratch out his words. Irina did tell Sydney she was the Chosen One, but it was Irina who in fact helped Sydney bring down the ball, and only one Derevko sister survived.

I believe it was Uncle111 who mentioned that we have yet to see the power of Rambaldi’s prophecies come true, that Sydney and the gang have fooled his every vision. But, if we look at his prophecies with Irina and Elena as the Chosen One and the Passenger, than much more of his prophecies have been true. We are unsure of Nadia’s capacity, but I found something in season 3 that was interesting. The DNA of the Passenger that is found by the Covenant is linked to 10 people, Nadia’s 10 aliases. Nadia is then link to one doctor that she had seen all her life. Lauren finds this doctor and interrogates him for the whereabouts of the Passenger. The doctor is located in Milan. If Nadia didn’t know she was the Passenger, and had no knowledge of Rambaldi, why would she be seeing a doctor in Milan? If she grew up in Argentina and worked for their government, why would she travel to Milan to see a doctor? Is it possible that she knows of her role in Rambaldi’s endgame? Or is it possible that the DNA spit out by El Dire was Elena’s? Elena had several aliases as well, and physically her DNA would be similar to Nadia’s because Elena is her aunt.

Am I on to something? How does this change all we know about Rambaldi?

I will also add a theory that was mentioned to me by Jenn256. What if the 12 CIA agents Irina killed are the agents that infiltrated the 12 government agencies that make up P5? What if she didn’t kill them, but extracted them from the CIA and used them as double agents? We have no concrete evidence that Bill Vaughn is actually dead, perhaps he is working for Irina.

So, wrap your head around these babies and let’s get blogging people!!!

Alias Count Down: 31 days!!

28 comments:

jenn256 said...

I love your theory about Irina actually being the Chosen One. We all naturally assumed it would be Syd and Nadia, but you are right, then more of Rambaldi's prophecies would be correct than if Syd was the Chosen one. Irina and Elena did do battle, and only one survived. So either Nadia or Syd are the child Rambaldi is referring to? But do we think Sloane knew this sicne he was a Rambaldi follower, maybe this is the reason he had an affair with Irina twice, hoping to produce the child mentioned in the prophecy?

But why would Irina tell Syd that she was the Chosen One? Is she misinformed (unlike Irina)? And when did she and Elena come across this information? Has she always known this, which would be another reason she married Jack,so their child, the Chosen One would go through Project Christmas training? Project Christmas is the reason she was sent to marry Jack in the first place right? So did she know all along that her child would be the Chosen one, and found out about Jack's Project Christmas, and maybe volunteered for the assignment to marry him,so her child would be safer?

As for the theory about Irina not really killing those 12 CIA agents, I read that on the board and just took it another step. That's why I love these boards,bouncing ideas off each other,coming up with great thoughts.

Kiki said...

I think perhaps all of Rambaldi's followers, maybe even Sloane, misinterpreted the prophecy. We've seen it before. And I don't think Irina meant that Sydney was actually The Chosen One, the chosen to render Elena defenseless.

srg-alias said...

I've always assumed that Nadia was definitely the Passenger (thus making Syd the Chosen One) because she channeled the Rambaldi drawings while under the influence of the fluid. It's an interesting point though, that she might have inherited that ability from the Derevko DNA and that maybe Elena or Katya is the real Passenger. It's a worthy theory, I don't think it would be too "out there" for Alias, very interesting to think about!

I like the theory of Irena extracting the 12 CIA agents rather than killing them. The number 12 is very significant with Alias because of the Alliance and now P5, I don't see the writers using it as just a coincidence.

BTW GS, I'm rewatching my recorded s5 episodes and taking notes on anything that stands out, I'll let you know if I come up w/ any questions or article ideas. :)

jenn256 said...

Where do you think Katya fits into this theory,if at all?

So you think everyone assumed it was Syd? If we go with this theory about Irina, does Sloane know, or did he misunderstand also, and if he does know, when did he find out?

Kiki said...

This is why I blog!! Awesome questions Jenn. Let's see if anyone has any answers.

uncle111 said...

GS-
This has always been a viable theory and should not be discounted, at least at this stage.

To through one more mystery into the mix- When Nadia and Sloane when to see Lazlo Drake before going to find the Sphere of Life, Drake says that meeting Nadia was like meeting the Virgin Mary and referred to her as a living embodiment.

So, consider these 3 things Nadia has been called- The Passenger, Virgin Mary, Living Embodiment.
A passenger is someone who is riding in something someone else is driving. The Virgin Mary carried and gave birth to the Saviour of mankind. A living embodiment is like another coming of someone or someone who carries someone else's essesence or consciousness. Sloane didn't want Nadia to hear these things about herself.

So, what exactly does this mean and how does it fit in?

Be sure to see my last posts under "Hey Lazarey."

uncle111 said...

Sorry, I can't believe all my misspellings. Guess I'm too dependant on spell check.

srg-alias said...

That's another question, how did Drake know Nadia was the Passenger (or assume) just by looking at her? We know people recognized Syd as the Chosen One because of the drawing in the Rambaldi Manuscript, but how would he know Nadia?

Kiki said...

Good question SRG!! Awesome Uncle111. Yahoo...what else, what else? Why would Sloane not want Nadia to know her role? How did Lazlo Drake know Nadia was the Passenger? Hmm, something is fishy?

jenn256 said...

No Uncle, I think you are just like me, too excited and passionate about what you are typing, I know I have that problem a lot. The ideas flow faster than my fingers type :)

Also Uncle, I agree about the title of Passenger for Nadia. I have always been curious about that. When I hear that she is the Passenger, I think that she is not the one in control, someone else is. I'm not sure what to think about the Virgin Mary reference. But what is she the Living Embodiment of?

jenn256 said...

yeah, how did Drake know? Didn't Sloane introduce her just as Nadia, or my daughter? If he said my daughter, then Drake would have known all along that Sloane was the Passengers father, and how would he have known that? I'll rewatch and see what I can figure out.

Kiki said...

nadia seems to have more "supernatural powers" when it comes to Rambaldi. She sees visions, like when she touched the Rambaldi box on that glass floor, and she could channel Rambaldi under the influence of the fluid. Syndey's never really experienced any of that.

jenn256 said...

In episode 5.19 "The Decent", Sloane and Nadia go to see Drake, he knows who Sloane is before he introduces himself because of his lifelong work with Rambaldi. And then Sloane introduces his "daughter Nadia". Right away Drake knows she is the Passenger, but how? Did he know from prohecies that Sloane's daughter would be the Passenger? And if this guy knew, why did it take Sloane so long to find out? Unless he knew his affair with the Chosen One would produce the Passenger? And why did Sloane take Nadia to see Drake before he had the Sphere of Life? He knew Drake wouldn't give him any of the information about the manuscript without all of the artifacts? What was that trip really about?

Another odd thing I noticed was that he didn't want Drake to touch Nadia. When he took her hand in his to greet her, Sloane broke off the gesture prematurely. Anyone else notice how odd that whole meeting was?

srg-alias said...

yeah it was a very awkward meeting jenn, the way Drake acted toward Nadia made me uncomfortable. He was basically treating her like a Godlike creature, and because of his strange treatment of her I understood why Sloane didn't want her to have contact w/ him. Drake looked at Nadia like an obsessed person or stalker or something. I think you're right that there was more to that meeting, why would Sloane go there when he knew Drake would give him the info. he needed w/o the Sphere of Life?

srg-alias said...

wouldn't, I mean to say wouldn't give him the info...

uncle111 said...

Jenn, I think that episode is pregnant with clues.

jenn256 said...

I agree Uncle!!! Why do we go straight to the meeting with Drake after Sloane promises Nadia he will "end this", referring to finding Elena. I suppose because he knows Elena would go to see Drake after recovering all of the clues. But even Nadia says on the way to see Drake, "Why are we in China when I told you the Sphere is in Siena". Why did he take her there first, she told him where the Sphere was. If he had gone to Siena first and gotten the Sphere, then Drake would have given him the location of the manuscript. Did Sloane himselfhave doubts about Nadia being the Passenger? Did he want confirmation from Drake? Sloane says he wants answers to a few questions, but never tells Nadia what those questions are.

I agree SRG, Drake was really wierd about meeting Nadia, really creepy. And Drake makes an odd comment about Sloane being so protective of her. Wouldn't he be protective of his daughter and "The Passenger"? Why would Drake question Sloane protectiveness over her? That whole episode is full of questions.

RUDY said...

Yep. It's one of those episodes that tries to fill in the gaps, but ends up growing more questions.

I'd respond to the topic, but I need it to sink in a little bit longer. It's a great one, GS!

Angie Hunt said...

I don't remember the prophecy saying that "the chosen one" would "bring forth" Rambaldi's work in the form of a child. I just remember the bringing forth his work and rendering "the greatest power" unto "utter desolation." Did it actually refer to a child? Or is my memory faulty? I am re-watching season one, so I'll have my answers soon enough.

Sometimes I have the feeling that the writers are writing by the seat of their pants and making it up as they go along, therefore we're bound to get inconsistencies. And sometimes I think they've established things in the past they'd just as soon forget. But half the fun of Alias is discerning between real clues and red herrings.

It's always fun to read your speculations. But I definitely think Syd was supposed to be the Chosen One in season one--that picture looks JUST like her.

Angie

Kiki said...

Kendall told Sydney on the plane when he was telling her about her missing 2 years that the Chosen One would bring forth his works in the form of a child. I don't remember his exact words, but it had something to do with a Rambaldi child and the Chosen One.

uncle111 said...

I think Kendall told Syd that was the Covenant's interpretaion of Rambaldi's prophecy.

RUDY said...

Okay. Definitely think that it's Sydney that the prophecy refers to. Why? Well, I rewatched the episode (2.22 "The Telling") that Irina's on the ledge and she says: "It's you in the prophecy, Sydney, not me."

As for Kendall, he only said that "Rambaldi spoke of a second coming" in the "Full Disclosure" episode (3.11) and made suggestions that the Covenant believes the prophecy will play out "in the form of a child."

jenn256 said...

so this whole child thing came from Kendall's re-telling of the Covenant's suspicion? So could Kendall have come up with that on his own, since we have had some suspicions about him anyway?

I do remember Irina telling Syd that it was Syd who the prophecy was referring to. But it seems to make more sense that it refers to Irina and Elena than Syd and Nadia.

birdietwoshoes said...

OK, so a while ago, I believe it was after the Derevko sisters article was posted, I was going to comment that I thought maybe Irina was the Chosen One and that Elena was the passenger. However, I thought I might get told, "What a dumb idea." and so I didn't. OK, so I know you guys wouldn't have told me it was dumb. Anyway, I have thought that ever since the end of S4 when Irina and Jack were walking through the street and Irina quotes that prophecy about the horses and the angels and says the Chosen One and the Passenger will battle and one will not survive. Obviously, Elena was killed. By Irina no less. And for prophecy to truly be considered prophecy, it has to come true. If it were Syd and Nadia Rambaldi was prophesying about, well, it didn't come true, did it? Anyway... The whole thing about the Chosen One (Just pretend it's Irina) bringing forth Rambaldis works (the manuscripts and such) in the form a child (Nadia helped decipher the manuscripts). The more I think about it, the more likely it seems that it's Irina and Elena, not Syd and Nadia.

jenn256 said...

I agree birdie, as far as we know Rambaldi's prophecies have always been correct, so why would this one be any different? But I can't stop wondering, did Irina know this or have a suspicion before the end of S4, or did she figure it out after? She's way to smart to have let that slip by her. She seemed so convinced talking to Jack that one of her daughters would "perrish tonight". But I cannot believe that she walked away from that night and didn't see that the prophecy pointed more towards her than Syd and Nadia. But she told Syd at the end of S2 that the prophecy was about Syd and not Irina, so was she lying or misinformed?

bristow_24 said...

I've always wondered about Irina and Elena as the two woman from the prophecy, especally since Syd proved the prophecy wrong back in season 1 by climbing Mount Sebastio. It really does make more sence that way, and it seems as though Irina has been trying to cover up the fact that she is the chosen. For what reason, I dont know. She told Sydney she was the chosen one back in "The telling", and in the fourth season finale she told Syd that she had fulfiled the prophecy. If Irina is the chosen, what are her reasons for keeping it secret?

Also, Your comment about the 12 agents murdered by Irina really poped out at me. Back in season 4, we saw a man who was killed, the same day as Bill Vaughn, and with the same bullets, so on...
Naturally, when it was uncovered that the gang had been douped by Elena we figured that this was a lie as well. But what if Bill Vaughn's death really was staged -god knows we've seen it before, perhaps even with Vaughn himself- and he is somehow helping Irina and co. to take down Prophet five? If so, in what capacity is he helping in this effort? Is Renne's father also in on it? If Vaughn is alive, does he know his father may be as well?

srg-alias said...

great questions bristow!! You're right that the "proof" of Vaughn's father's death being faked was just forgotten when it was proven the scheme was orchestrated by Elena, but that still doesn't mean it wasn't true...

uncle111 said...

I have doubts that Elena could have exchanged Bill Vaughn's info with the other guy's in the CIA's files...unless Sloane did it.
It is possible BV did it before his death was faked.